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	<title>Comments on: Laker/Suns Chat: Game 5</title>
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	<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/</link>
	<description>A Lakers Blog. Thoughts, reflections, and the odd rant on the Los Angeles Lakers and the NBA (even the Clippers).</description>
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		<title>By: robinred</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-95862</link>
		<dc:creator>robinred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 May 2007 03:27:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-95862</guid>
		<description>&quot;Kurtâ€™s right, itâ€™s not so much about which system/paradigm you use, itâ€™s about who has the best personnel for their system and who executes their system the most effectively.&quot;

Yes and no. On the level of the 5th-8th guys, sure. For example, Diaw and Barbosa look a lot better on the Suns than they would elsewhere. But in terms of the top 2-3 guys, in terms of getting to the championship level, I think it is about who they are more than the system. 

 &quot;So where would Detroitâ€™s paradigm be then?&quot;

You can play that game all day. What if Chris Webber and Valde Divac had made more of their FTs in Game 7 of the Western Finals that year? And, the point about Detroit was that it is possible to get the trophy that way, but harder. Much harder, historically.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Kurtâ€™s right, itâ€™s not so much about which system/paradigm you use, itâ€™s about who has the best personnel for their system and who executes their system the most effectively.&#8221;</p>
<p>Yes and no. On the level of the 5th-8th guys, sure. For example, Diaw and Barbosa look a lot better on the Suns than they would elsewhere. But in terms of the top 2-3 guys, in terms of getting to the championship level, I think it is about who they are more than the system. </p>
<p> &#8220;So where would Detroitâ€™s paradigm be then?&#8221;</p>
<p>You can play that game all day. What if Chris Webber and Valde Divac had made more of their FTs in Game 7 of the Western Finals that year? And, the point about Detroit was that it is possible to get the trophy that way, but harder. Much harder, historically.</p>
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		<title>By: Muddywood</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-95260</link>
		<dc:creator>Muddywood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 May 2007 06:19:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-95260</guid>
		<description>As I have said in previous posts, I like Lamars game but he is NOT a #2 star on a team.  He is just not consistent enough. He never has been.  Why would anything change now?  He is what he is.  A very talented but inconsistent player.
  I would package Lamar and Bynum and Cook if needed to try to go after a true #2 star to compliment Kobe.  Someone that will get 20 &amp;12(if its a post player) EVERY NIGHT.  THat is what Kobe needs.  He needs a consistent #2 scorer beside him.  THen Luke can be the #3 guy, or Vlad, or Mo Evans,  or whoever. 

I&#039;ll bet Kobe would agree.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As I have said in previous posts, I like Lamars game but he is NOT a #2 star on a team.  He is just not consistent enough. He never has been.  Why would anything change now?  He is what he is.  A very talented but inconsistent player.<br />
  I would package Lamar and Bynum and Cook if needed to try to go after a true #2 star to compliment Kobe.  Someone that will get 20 &amp;12(if its a post player) EVERY NIGHT.  THat is what Kobe needs.  He needs a consistent #2 scorer beside him.  THen Luke can be the #3 guy, or Vlad, or Mo Evans,  or whoever. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ll bet Kobe would agree.</p>
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		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-94992</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 19:39:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94992</guid>
		<description>Also, Kurt, I want to second what Cary D. (37), said. Coming from a former journalism major, I consider your posts to be educated, knowledgeable, thoughtful, articulate, and intelligent.

I only recently discovered your blog, and in a day and age where the Net is polluted with mindless ranting and venom, your posts are always a joy to read. Thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Also, Kurt, I want to second what Cary D. (37), said. Coming from a former journalism major, I consider your posts to be educated, knowledgeable, thoughtful, articulate, and intelligent.</p>
<p>I only recently discovered your blog, and in a day and age where the Net is polluted with mindless ranting and venom, your posts are always a joy to read. Thank you.</p>
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		<title>By: matt</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-94990</link>
		<dc:creator>matt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 19:33:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94990</guid>
		<description>(49)(51)(52) â€“ A lot of it also has to do with matchups. For instance, this season the Spurs seem to have the Sunsâ€™ number, the Suns seem to have the Mavsâ€™ number, and the Mavs seem to have the Spursâ€™ number. So which paradigm is better?

Looking back to the â€™04 Finals, the two main reasons the Pistons beat the Lakers were that, 1)  the Lakers had no chemistry, it seemed like everyone on that team hated eachother, and 2) Karl Malone got injured and we had no interior defense.

You could also argue that if Tayshaun Prince hadnâ€™t swatted away Reggie Millerâ€™s layup at the end of game 4 in the Eastern semis that year, and Indy had gone up 3-1 on Detroit, the Pacers might have won, and that also might have led to the Lakers winning another title. So where would Detroitâ€™s paradigm be then?

If Golden State upsets Dallas, thatâ€™s not a validation of their paradigm, itâ€™s a validation of Don Nelson tactics against his former team. If the Warriors had faced the Spurs instead, I think theyâ€™d be home by now, just like the Nuggets are.

Kurtâ€™s right, itâ€™s not so much about which system/paradigm you use, itâ€™s about who has the best personnel for their system and who executes their system the most effectively.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(49)(51)(52) â€“ A lot of it also has to do with matchups. For instance, this season the Spurs seem to have the Sunsâ€™ number, the Suns seem to have the Mavsâ€™ number, and the Mavs seem to have the Spursâ€™ number. So which paradigm is better?</p>
<p>Looking back to the â€™04 Finals, the two main reasons the Pistons beat the Lakers were that, 1)  the Lakers had no chemistry, it seemed like everyone on that team hated eachother, and 2) Karl Malone got injured and we had no interior defense.</p>
<p>You could also argue that if Tayshaun Prince hadnâ€™t swatted away Reggie Millerâ€™s layup at the end of game 4 in the Eastern semis that year, and Indy had gone up 3-1 on Detroit, the Pacers might have won, and that also might have led to the Lakers winning another title. So where would Detroitâ€™s paradigm be then?</p>
<p>If Golden State upsets Dallas, thatâ€™s not a validation of their paradigm, itâ€™s a validation of Don Nelson tactics against his former team. If the Warriors had faced the Spurs instead, I think theyâ€™d be home by now, just like the Nuggets are.</p>
<p>Kurtâ€™s right, itâ€™s not so much about which system/paradigm you use, itâ€™s about who has the best personnel for their system and who executes their system the most effectively.</p>
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		<title>By: JONESONTHENBA</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-94980</link>
		<dc:creator>JONESONTHENBA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 18:49:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94980</guid>
		<description>John R.: Your comments are so laughable. You only appear when the Lakers are down. Your constant knocking of Kobe is ridiculous. Everyone from scouts (that I personally know) to GMs, to actual NBA players all say that Kobe Bryant is the best player in basketball. If you can&#039;t understand that, then I don&#039;t know what to do with you. 

Also, I write about more than the Lakers on Fanhouse. If you only see the Lakers posts, it shows me how much you don&#039;t pay attention to things.

Lastly, what&#039;s your favorite team? Do you have one? Unlike you, I happen to have one. It&#039;s the Lakers. It&#039;s been the Lakers since I started watching basketball. If Kobe Bryant left the Lakers, I&#039;m still going to be a fan of the Forum Blue and Gold. That&#039;s what real fans do. This negativity. The hating on Kobe and the Lakers. Where does it come from? Let&#039;s be real here. The Lakers are the most successful franchise in the History of basketball. They&#039;ve pretty much been in Finals in every single decade. They&#039;ve won, what, 14 Championships (in Minn and LA)?  Sorry if they don&#039;t win every year. But I don&#039;t see those Suns or Clippers or Kings, or whatever team you&#039;re a fan of today with any sort of ring.

And I&#039;m still waiting on my apology. You were wrong with the salary cap, just like you&#039;re wrong about Kobe and the downfall of the Lakers. The Lakers have won three championships this decade. More than anyone else this decade. I&#039;d say their doing just fine for themselves. Ask the warriors fans (who had to wait 13 years to appear in the playoffs again) what a poorly run franchise is about. Ask the Clippers fans who are happy with making the playoffs every ten years what a poorly run franchise is like. It&#039;s not like the Lakers. In the 28 years Buss has run this franchise the Lakers have won the championship 8 times, and been 13 NBA Finals and 15 Conference Finals. If you don&#039;t have faith in the Lakers becoming a championship team again, it just shows why you really aren&#039;t a Laker fan. Do us all a favor and stay out of Forum Blue and Gold threads.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John R.: Your comments are so laughable. You only appear when the Lakers are down. Your constant knocking of Kobe is ridiculous. Everyone from scouts (that I personally know) to GMs, to actual NBA players all say that Kobe Bryant is the best player in basketball. If you can&#8217;t understand that, then I don&#8217;t know what to do with you. </p>
<p>Also, I write about more than the Lakers on Fanhouse. If you only see the Lakers posts, it shows me how much you don&#8217;t pay attention to things.</p>
<p>Lastly, what&#8217;s your favorite team? Do you have one? Unlike you, I happen to have one. It&#8217;s the Lakers. It&#8217;s been the Lakers since I started watching basketball. If Kobe Bryant left the Lakers, I&#8217;m still going to be a fan of the Forum Blue and Gold. That&#8217;s what real fans do. This negativity. The hating on Kobe and the Lakers. Where does it come from? Let&#8217;s be real here. The Lakers are the most successful franchise in the History of basketball. They&#8217;ve pretty much been in Finals in every single decade. They&#8217;ve won, what, 14 Championships (in Minn and LA)?  Sorry if they don&#8217;t win every year. But I don&#8217;t see those Suns or Clippers or Kings, or whatever team you&#8217;re a fan of today with any sort of ring.</p>
<p>And I&#8217;m still waiting on my apology. You were wrong with the salary cap, just like you&#8217;re wrong about Kobe and the downfall of the Lakers. The Lakers have won three championships this decade. More than anyone else this decade. I&#8217;d say their doing just fine for themselves. Ask the warriors fans (who had to wait 13 years to appear in the playoffs again) what a poorly run franchise is about. Ask the Clippers fans who are happy with making the playoffs every ten years what a poorly run franchise is like. It&#8217;s not like the Lakers. In the 28 years Buss has run this franchise the Lakers have won the championship 8 times, and been 13 NBA Finals and 15 Conference Finals. If you don&#8217;t have faith in the Lakers becoming a championship team again, it just shows why you really aren&#8217;t a Laker fan. Do us all a favor and stay out of Forum Blue and Gold threads.</p>
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		<title>By: robinred</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-94928</link>
		<dc:creator>robinred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 17:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94928</guid>
		<description>Agree with 51,  with the possible caveat of the international influence representing a minor paradigm shift. I recall reading pieces during the Jordan era about how centers were passe. Then, with Jordan gone, teams with Tim Duncan (he functions as a 5 lot) and David Robinson and teams with Shaquille O&#039;Neal have won a total of 7 titles, conceding that Wade was the #1 guy on Miami last year, of course--they don&#039;t have rings without the Diesel deal.  The non-big-dog  title was won by Detroit, so as Kurt says, the issue is talent, but the real question is how the talent is arranged. It is historically very difficult to win with several good players (the Dumars paradigm) as opposed to the superstar/star/third option/role players paradigm. But, as recent threads indicate, usually said role players are veterans, not a bunch of young guys. The Lakers have a #1 guy, a #3 guy, and a bunch of young, part-time players. A complex problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Agree with 51,  with the possible caveat of the international influence representing a minor paradigm shift. I recall reading pieces during the Jordan era about how centers were passe. Then, with Jordan gone, teams with Tim Duncan (he functions as a 5 lot) and David Robinson and teams with Shaquille O&#8217;Neal have won a total of 7 titles, conceding that Wade was the #1 guy on Miami last year, of course&#8211;they don&#8217;t have rings without the Diesel deal.  The non-big-dog  title was won by Detroit, so as Kurt says, the issue is talent, but the real question is how the talent is arranged. It is historically very difficult to win with several good players (the Dumars paradigm) as opposed to the superstar/star/third option/role players paradigm. But, as recent threads indicate, usually said role players are veterans, not a bunch of young guys. The Lakers have a #1 guy, a #3 guy, and a bunch of young, part-time players. A complex problem.</p>
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		<title>By: Kurt</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-2/#comment-94868</link>
		<dc:creator>Kurt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 15:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94868</guid>
		<description>49. I think it&#039;s more about fitting talent to the system than the system. Try to get the Suns players to play the San Antonio system and it would be a failure. I&#039;m good with the Lakers being a triangle team if they get the players to fit that system. Which means some changes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>49. I think it&#8217;s more about fitting talent to the system than the system. Try to get the Suns players to play the San Antonio system and it would be a failure. I&#8217;m good with the Lakers being a triangle team if they get the players to fit that system. Which means some changes.</p>
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		<title>By: robinred</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-1/#comment-94810</link>
		<dc:creator>robinred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 12:41:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94810</guid>
		<description>&quot;Do it and do it now,&quot; [Bryant} said. &quot;Personally for me, it&#039;s beyond frustration -- three years and still being at ground zero. This summer&#039;s a big summer. We have to see what direction we want to take as an organization and make those steps and make them now.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Do it and do it now,&#8221; [Bryant} said. &#8220;Personally for me, it&#8217;s beyond frustration &#8212; three years and still being at ground zero. This summer&#8217;s a big summer. We have to see what direction we want to take as an organization and make those steps and make them now.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: DrRayEye</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-1/#comment-94800</link>
		<dc:creator>DrRayEye</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 10:43:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94800</guid>
		<description>Kurt,

It appears to me that basketball has been going through some kind of paradigm shift--perhaps continuously.

It was started most recently by the Pistons when they eliminated the classic &quot;Shaq-Kobe&quot; Lakers with a &quot;team&quot; versus center and a&quot;star.&quot;  

Phoenix kept the &quot;team,&quot; but switched the focus to a distributor.  San Antonio remains &quot;old school,&quot; but relies on a power forward rather than a center--with a new international flavor.  Dallas has found a way to merge the two with both a power forward and a team approach that balances offense and defense in a modified D&#039;Antonio.  

Until the playoffs, Dallas seemed to be the next and best evolutionary step--leaving innovative Phoenix without a title.

In facing Nelly, the Dallas approach seems suddenly old and out of date.  Phoenix once again seems the better model for the future.  If the Warriors and Phoenix both make their way to the Western Division final, we may be looking at two colors of the new pro paradigm.  If either Golden State or Phoenix faces either Detroit or Chicago, it will be a new team generation  of offense meeting the existing team champion of defense for the NBA title.  

If the Laker ideal is San Antonio (and I think that it is), but the San Antonio approach has been passed by, might not the newest and possibly &quot;future&quot; way be found not far from San Francisco Bay--and the victory last year by Miami was the last gasp of a dinasour.

If the paradigm has already gone beyond the Suns toward the Warriors, maybe the Lakers are already a lot closer than we think.  Adding a Kevin Garnett might point us backward while Nellie, like Dumars, moves forward with the Baron Davis that the Lakers didn&#039;t want, the Matt Barnhes that nobody wanted, and the Al Harrington that Indiana rejected twice.

Dumars act of genius this year was to get a Chris Webber that had been kicked around in recent years--and we didn&#039;t want.

Is the paradigm shifting?  As the NBA playoffs continue, we may get more clues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Kurt,</p>
<p>It appears to me that basketball has been going through some kind of paradigm shift&#8211;perhaps continuously.</p>
<p>It was started most recently by the Pistons when they eliminated the classic &#8220;Shaq-Kobe&#8221; Lakers with a &#8220;team&#8221; versus center and a&#8221;star.&#8221;  </p>
<p>Phoenix kept the &#8220;team,&#8221; but switched the focus to a distributor.  San Antonio remains &#8220;old school,&#8221; but relies on a power forward rather than a center&#8211;with a new international flavor.  Dallas has found a way to merge the two with both a power forward and a team approach that balances offense and defense in a modified D&#8217;Antonio.  </p>
<p>Until the playoffs, Dallas seemed to be the next and best evolutionary step&#8211;leaving innovative Phoenix without a title.</p>
<p>In facing Nelly, the Dallas approach seems suddenly old and out of date.  Phoenix once again seems the better model for the future.  If the Warriors and Phoenix both make their way to the Western Division final, we may be looking at two colors of the new pro paradigm.  If either Golden State or Phoenix faces either Detroit or Chicago, it will be a new team generation  of offense meeting the existing team champion of defense for the NBA title.  </p>
<p>If the Laker ideal is San Antonio (and I think that it is), but the San Antonio approach has been passed by, might not the newest and possibly &#8220;future&#8221; way be found not far from San Francisco Bay&#8211;and the victory last year by Miami was the last gasp of a dinasour.</p>
<p>If the paradigm has already gone beyond the Suns toward the Warriors, maybe the Lakers are already a lot closer than we think.  Adding a Kevin Garnett might point us backward while Nellie, like Dumars, moves forward with the Baron Davis that the Lakers didn&#8217;t want, the Matt Barnhes that nobody wanted, and the Al Harrington that Indiana rejected twice.</p>
<p>Dumars act of genius this year was to get a Chris Webber that had been kicked around in recent years&#8211;and we didn&#8217;t want.</p>
<p>Is the paradigm shifting?  As the NBA playoffs continue, we may get more clues.</p>
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		<title>By: pgblooded</title>
		<link>http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/comment-page-1/#comment-94782</link>
		<dc:creator>pgblooded</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 09:18:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.forumblueandgold.com/2007/05/02/lakersuns-chat-game-5/#comment-94782</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know how to put it but I am not that excited about off-season possibilities for our team.  

It might just add up to the frustrations.  All the speculations and hearsays.  

Anyways,in case the front office will indeed be busy this off-season,  I just wish the team will be able to acquire a couple of pure shooters and a bigman capable of creating a shot off the dribble.   Basically something that the triangle requires.     

Ime Uodoka has a good range.  I hope we can accomodate JO.  How about drafting certified gunner from the Euro League (No more practice shooters like Shasha please!). 

A point guard who has a decent jumpshot and can play defense will be enough in the triangle. 

Honestly, I am not expecting something big. Hoping and praying would be a better way to put it, I guess.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know how to put it but I am not that excited about off-season possibilities for our team.  </p>
<p>It might just add up to the frustrations.  All the speculations and hearsays.  </p>
<p>Anyways,in case the front office will indeed be busy this off-season,  I just wish the team will be able to acquire a couple of pure shooters and a bigman capable of creating a shot off the dribble.   Basically something that the triangle requires.     </p>
<p>Ime Uodoka has a good range.  I hope we can accomodate JO.  How about drafting certified gunner from the Euro League (No more practice shooters like Shasha please!). </p>
<p>A point guard who has a decent jumpshot and can play defense will be enough in the triangle. </p>
<p>Honestly, I am not expecting something big. Hoping and praying would be a better way to put it, I guess.</p>
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