Drafting 19th

Kurt —  May 14, 2007

For those of you wondering what kind of player you can get drafting 19th — where the Lakers sit this year — here is the list of 19th selections going back to 1990:

Quincy Douby, Sacramento
Hakim Warrick, Memphis
Dorell Wright, Miami
Aleksandar Pavlovic, Utah
Ryan Humphrey, Utah
Zach Randolph, Portland
Jamaal Magloire, Charlotte
Quincy Lewis, Utah
Pat Garrity, Millwaulke
Scot Pollard, Detroit
Walter McCarty, New York
Randolph Childress, Detroit
Tony Dumas, Dallas
Acie Earl, Boston
Don MacLean, Detroit
LaBradford Smith, Washington
Dee Brown, Boston

Some pretty good players on that list plus a few, well, not so goods.

A couple things of note. First, these are not players that contributed much immediately but some grew into good players after a few years. Second, the hit and miss nature of this spot in the draft means it has limited value for trades — even in a deep draft nobody really wants the 19th pick.

Kurt

Posts

33 responses to Drafting 19th

  1. Taking Risk on Ron Artest:
    The Lakers could offer Kwame Brown in a match of similar salaries. The Kings would inherit the frustration of an enigmatic player unable to grasp his considerable potential, but also the benefit of being able to clear cap space a year earlier than with Artest if Brown did not work out. Sacramento Bee

    The Lakers also could offer Luke Walton in a sign-and-trade, packaged with another, lesser salary (Sasha Vujacic, Maurice Evans, Brian Cook). Sacramento Bee

  2. Aside the fact that is a newspaper guy speculating, do we really want Artest on this team. He fits the defensive need on paper, but….

  3. 2 Quincy’s? Can we get Hollinger on this? Every Quincy ever drafted into the NBA has been drafted 19th.

    Just like every Quintin, Quentin and Quinton ever to play in the NBA has done time with the Clippers…

  4. I think we have enough youth. We use our 19th in a package to get another player out there with experience.

    Likely trade partners in my mind: Boston, Atlanta, Portland, Charlotte, Philadelphia, New York, or New Orleans.

  5. Kwame/Lamar/19th pick for KG. Come one KG, we need your help.

  6. If Phil Jackson is ok with Artest joining the team, then I have no problem. Of course, everyone will mention the Rodman parallels – also, if Artest can’t make it work in LA with Kobe and Phil Jackson, his career is pretty much over.

    Kupchak and Jackson have both said they want to upgrade the center position – whether they move Kwame or not, how do how would they do that absent resigning Mihm? Who’s available?

  7. This is pedantic, but if we want to know “what kind of player you can get drafting 19th”, shouldn’t we look at all the picks #19 *and below* from previous drafts? A player that you can get at #20 is a player you could’ve gotten at #19, and so on.

    Kurt’s correct, though, that the spot (and those below it) is not high enough to warrant much interest from other teams, and that once you get below a certain draft number, it’s typically hit-and-miss.

  8. great stat kurt. 19th picks really just fill up a roster space and if you’re lucky — you can find a role player who fits your team. seems like a 1 in 3 chance that happens.

    only in the best of circumstances can you find a star.

    btw, check out Henry Abbot’s post today regarding the Suns/Spurs. one of the most well-written pieces i’ve read in a long while. Good Laker references in there as well.

    http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-24-62/Feeling-Violated-by-Playoff-Basketball.html

  9. 7. AM, I thought that too, but didn’t want this to be a “I can’t believe they passed on….” type post, the idea was generally what kind of talent you can get at 19. That said, smart scouting and talent evaluating can land you someone solid to good at 19.

    8 Cary D, That is indeed great stuff (I love Thorpe). Those 80s Laker teams were anything but soft. I had already read that and thought about mentioning it down the line, I think Henry’s point that the Suns have to be the Suns regardless of what is going on around them — they need to impose their style on the game, despite the hurdles.

  10. I’m a believer that we should trade at least 2 of our 3 picks. This team needs to go forward.

  11. There are a lot of good prospects out there that the Lakers could pick up (if they keep the pick). I like Rodney Stuckey
    Acie Law
    Nick Young

    I think Stuckey and Young might end up being the steals of the draft. Because the draft is so deep, young and Stuckey are going to be availabe down there, when they usually would be lottery or near lottery picks.

    Check out both of their profiles:

    Young:
    http://draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=385

    Stuckey:
    http://draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=1015

    In the second round, I’m all about picking Bobby Brown. I think he’s a steal in the second round. Here’s his profile:
    http://www.draftexpress.com/viewprofile.php?p=561

  12. sanchez101, Eric Pincus (find it at LG) had a nice piece about Gasol, which seemed to be a possible scenario depending on how Memphis fairs in the Lotto… that’s one sure way to upgrade at the C. …and I agree, we really had no offense from the center position this year, Kwame was nervous and kicked it back out, Andrew had 1 or 2 movies…Ronnie was possibly our best C this year, at least he had a mid range shot, some awesome dunks, and of course, his hustle on D… but Ronnie is not really a C, would be better I think in his natural position, PF. I hope we get that Gasol move, in exchange for Bynum and Kwame. I like his game. I didn’t realize he was a 20/10 guy…we could use that! especially if we get to keep LO, we could have a nice front line. then use the MLE on a PG.

  13. Chris, I like Eric Pincus but what he does is come up with scenarios. Discussing Memphis pre-lottery seems useless.

    Jonesonthenba: No way Nick Young is around at 19. Rumor from Chad Ford is that he already has wowed in workouts and is looking like he will move into the lottery.

  14. Hey guys,
    Shaq is in the TNT studio tonight to watch the games and they just had a mini-interview with Shaq right before the Spurs Suns game to fill some time and Ernie Johnson asked Shaq who he thought was the MVP this year and Shaq’s answer was Kobe Bryant. Shaq said that there were 18 games this year where a player scored 50 points and Kobe had 10 of those games. Therefore, Shaq says, that if he had a vote for MVP it would have gone to Kobe Bryant.

    It appears that after all these years, Shaquille has finally grown up and moved on and let go of the grudge.

    Funny what crazy things losing brings out of people.

  15. While skimming thru Bucks RealGM site I was suprised to see they are thinking of running Triangle next season.
    I realize this is sorta off-topic,but if Bucks draft Durrant,may I be first to suggest Odom for Redd. for those who think the Lakers need a second scorer….
    Play small w/Kwame,Walton,Bryant,Redd and a fast,defensive PG(Keyon Dooling type). On D go to a 2-3 zone,or a trapping,switching D.(In the West only Yao is a traditional low post C,the rest of the Cs shoot from perimeter where Walton can guard them,or are not too involved in the offence,and Brown can defend the horde of skilled PFs.)Farmer,Bynum and Turaif can anchor second unit.
    In the real world,if I’m the Lakers I would consider doing a sign/trade of Walton for Gadzuric. The Bucks would get a good passer who knows Triangle and Lakers fortify their interior D.

  16. Kurt do the Lakers want to get younger or older? why add more young players when we need to win?

  17. Now that would be interesting: Getting Artest for Walton and another player.

    The problem I have with Artest for Kwame is that our defensive middle would be wide open. The Kings allowed 103.1 per contest. The Lakers allowed 103.4 points per contest.

    The Kings played with Brad Miller in the middle and with Mike Bibby at the points and still gave up 103.1 points per contest.

    My point is that you can’t give up your defensive middle for the likes of Artest because Artest couldn’t stop opponents from attacking the middle of the lane in Sacramento. What makes people think he’ll be able to do it in Los Angeles if we give up Kwame?

    Chris Mihm and Andrew Bynum haven’t proven they can man the defensive middle. Bynum may develop into a defensive stopper but there’s no way Mihm will ever be a defensive presence.

    Now giving up Luke Walton and another player for Artest would work perfectly.

  18. Surgery for Odom Update

    Not that this will come as a huge shock to anyone, but Lamar Odom will have surgery tomorrow to repair the torn labrum in his left shoulder. As I’m sure most of you know, Odom was playing through substantial pain late in the season. A timetable for Odom’s return likely will be announced after the surgery tomorrow, but under normal circumstances he should be fine for training camp. Dr. Lewis Yocum will perform the surgery.

  19. LakerFan, while I advocate bringing in some veterans, via trade or free agency, that doesn’t mean you don’t draft anyone. The 19th pick, even packaged with one of the second rounders, is not going to net much of value (unless the Lakers can find something like the Mo Evans deal, where the Pistons just wanted to unload him).

    If the Lakers bring in a couple more seasoned vets, any young draftees could learn a lot from them. Anyone the Lakers get at 19 is not going to play significant minutes next season. At least I hope not, if so it would be a bad sign.

  20. Shaq, as always, was freakin hilarious tonight. I get annoyed with Laker fans who practically write off what the man did for this franchise.

    After that first championship, I told myself that if I ever saw Shaq in the streets, I would hug him for the euphoria created by that Game 7 against Portland. Kind of like the feeling Red Sox fans have after the 2004 World Series. You shouldn’t forget those moments.

    He made us championship contenders every year. How can we just forget this, especially with the view we have during these playoffs as bystanders to other teams going further than our current squad.

    Shaq is always a Laker in my heart of hearts. Great to see him on TNT being silly as always.

    I also enjoyed Kobe on TNT last year during the Mavs vs. Spurs. He was fantastic. His analysis of the European crossover by Manu Ginobli made me think of him on another level. These guys were special. We were so lucky.

  21. Btw, what the hell was up with the end of that Spurs/Suns game?

    Is it possible that Horry and other Spurs actually calculated that incident? All they had to do was get the Suns riled up to start a scene. Maybe they figured a few guys would act a fool and get suspended? I hope not.

    That was a bad way to end that game. Robert Horry usually keeps his head on straight. It would be bad for the league if the Spurs beat the Suns sans Amare.

  22. Kurt whats the point?

    we have 3 draft picks this year so in essence we add 3 young players on our team. and we will get less then 3 veteran players which means we’re still a young team.

    Young teams can’t win championships.

  23. LakerFan — Kurt’s point is that you generally can do nothing to help your team by trading away late picks. Mo Evans (even then, not a huge difference maker) was a smart pick-up but not the norm. This is not the NFL draft, where the 19th pick is a HUGE commodity. The 19th pick, at best, is good for an asset in a bigger trade where we give up key pieces of our team, as well as a 1st round draft pick for someone else .

    Most times, you are better off rolling the dice on a draft pick you believe in. You get older by smart free agent signings, but you build your core team through the draft.

    Maybe if we didn’t use our money to sign Vlad, Cookie, and Sasha, we could enjoy this theory and not feel this pressure to trade away our pick.

  24. That was a crazy ending. It’s not like the Spurs to shoot just 28% in the fourth quarter and give up a lead like that. Stoudemire was, well, amazing.

    The guy who could be in trouble is Bell. But suspensions could swing game five.

  25. Cary D- This draft is deep no one cares if its 19th or if its a early 2nd round any player in the 1st round has a good chance to be a good player in this league. so the 19th pick holds value. for us we can’t always keep adding young players when we need to win. i think the past 2 seasons were okay but not now. not after Kobes statement about winning. you can’t expect to win when you’re team has no experience.

  26. LakerFan, what I have meant by the Lakers getting more experience was simply one or two key players. A key frontline guy and a key backcourt guy would allow players like Luke, Radmanovic, Evans, Farmar and Turiaf to come off the bench and that would be formidable. Behind them can be a draft pick or whatever, those end of the bench sports are great for young projects (or, send one to the D League). Those vets can come via a trade or the MLE.

    And, despite this being a deep draft, the 19th pick will be a gamble, and teams are not going to give you a quality veteran for it. If the Lakers throw it in a bigger deal that’s great, but making the pick is not a big deal in my mind.

  27. warren (philippines) May 15, 2007 at 2:53 am

    Two things covered by recent write ups were the names of Pau Gasol and Ron Artest. Of all the rumblings we are experiencing, and Kobe himself rumbling over losing, it is quite expected that something is going to happen.

    Any of those two wont yield you KG type numbers but they are definitely upgrades from our current roster proveided the core is un-touched. They will be additions to our core.

    My opinion of course is, Pau Gasol first before Artest. At least in my mind it would be very difficult to do both. Both deals somehow require Kwame’s contract and the #19 pick. Bynum’s inclusion is contingent to any name bigger than the aforementioned.

    In my mind, there can be multiple combinations we can do with Memphis. (assuming they Draft Durant – he sells more than Oden anyway). I can live with Bynum, Kwame and the #19 to Memphis plus add ins from both sides. Hopefully, Memphis can absorb one or two uglies we have, preferably Brian Cook and/or Sasha.

    I was also thinking maybe a Radmanovic + #40 pick can be enough to land either Mike James or Marco Jaric. Who knows? We could improve our PG spot a little bit this way. And its no blockbuster… It can be done over a few bottles of beers. (Rhetorical Joke)

  28. I like Gasol better for the Lakers than Artest, but that said 1) Gasol is not a defensive presence inside, he just makes that offense batter; 2) We have no idea what Memphis will want until after the Lottery. They get Durant and maybe Gasol decides he wants to stay with Gay and Durant. They get Odom and Bynum isn’t needed. So we wait and see.

  29. If we followed what Bill Simmons half heartedly supported and what the Boston Celtics made so apparent late in the season, we wouldn’t even have to discuss the value of the 19th pick. Tanking… think about it. Kobe and Durant? haha. On a real note, the current roster is not even close to being the stuff of champions. With the restrictions we’ve placed on ourselves, it’s very difficult to see the team drastically improving in the next 2 years. Though much can happen on draft day, it’s very difficult for me to see the Lakers taking advantage of the remaining years of Kobe’s prime. That being said, they need to do WHATEVERBynum, Odom

  30. Whoops…. they need to do WHATEVER they can. Bynum, Odom, nobody should be untouchable. To be cliche, Desperate times call for desperate measures.

  31. That Spurs 4th quarter choke job sure brought back some good memories of the early part of this decade.

    Skigi- I too thought it was very “mature” of the DIesel to show KB some love.

    Kurt- I don’t think the Lakers have the pieces to get any of the desired free agents, Chicago has a better offer for Gasol (Deng/Gordon/picks), Phoenix (if they get Atlanta’s pick) will have more to offer for KG and Denver may have more to offer for Artest. This only leaves Jermaine O’neal and is it really worth it to give up Odom for Jermaine?

  32. It seems that the Lakers will not make a big name signing this off-season. Too much reality works against it. But I wouldn’t be surprised to see two or three medium impact signings. They could add up to more than the sum of their parts. We’ve already seen suggestions here that are doable. I’m sure Laker management has the names as well.

    Suns/Spurs: I’d hate to see Amare and Diaw out for Game 5. There was no fight and they went back to the bench pretty quickly. This case is a perfect illustration of what’s wrong with zero-tolerance policies. I didn’t like them applied to the Lakers this season, I don’t want to see them applied in the best playoff series going.

  33. 31. Kwame a., the only way O’Neal makes sense for me is if the Lakers don’t give up Odom. (So, something like Kwame, Bynum, Cook and a pick.) That allows Odom to move to the three and Kobe the two, O’Neal brings some defensive toughness inside and some intimidation, and while is offensive game has flaws (he shot just 43.6% last season) he’s an improvement from our post scoring now. His presence inside makes Farmar a better defender out top (if that is the PG next year).

    But all that only works if Odom stays. Odom for O’Neal is basically a slight upgrade.