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“But he does produce similar or above average production from his constant, more so then the .75 ratio you have given. It’s just that people remember the few bad games then the many good ones.”

I’m saying I wish he did have that percentage of games in which he was positive on the Lakers’ results. Since 2004, that’s not at all what I’ve seen. And I acknowledged many specific situations in which he did play well.

“For the few times his production drops from the mean, there are far more numerous times where his constant/above-average production puts his team in a higher level to succeed.”

Few times? Have we been watching all the same games since 2004? Your argument here is practically tautological.

“Yes. Scarcity/Production of his position at least to me gives him more value the Ariza, who is has a lot of value for himself already. Of course, that answer precludes to the circumstance of choosing one or the other.”

Okay, direct answer, I appreciate that. However, does overall value have to imply resign priority? If Odom were worth 14M or even 11M (and I would argue that currently he is not), would we really want to sign him instead of Ariza for 6M?

“Even though it’s not well known to most, Odom is an elite defensive player. Even though not proficient in steals (which plays a small part in the equation), he does well in PER/against, opp/eFG%, opp/TS% etc. In short, his opponents’ efficiency drops off against him.”

I do not agree. The people that vote on all-NBA defensive teams do not agree. I don’t care about steals or blocks (though they are nice, useful ways of characterizing an individual defender). While Odom may have a positive impact on team defense, I think saying he’s an elite defender based on the stats you’ve mentioned is not unlike John Hollinger saying he believes Ginobli is a better player than Kobe based on his stats.

“’And I do still remember Odom playing Marion very well in the 2006 playoffs, but I also remember him blowing the rebound in game 6 that allowed Phoenix to send it into overtime.’

‘I remember that last sequence, but I doubt Lamar blew’ it.”

Watch it again. If by blew it, you mean anything other than didn’t focus at the right time, didn’t box out and the result was the Suns got the rebound and tied the game to send it to overtime, then you’re right, he didn’t blow it.

His lack of attentiveness did manifest in that moment in a game-changing situation with a negative result for the Lakers.

Odom also lost a game for us in the regular season (I think 07-08) by deciding to drive left at the end of the game with something like 15 seconds left and 10-12 seconds left on the shot clock with maybe a 2-3 point lead. He got an offensive foul and we lost.

“‘Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t Odom a total no show in last year’s Finals?”’

‘No-show? So his production went down previous to the last 3 rounds, but so did the entire team.’”

That’s a fair point. However, he still didn’t step up when he had a chance. Making him a priority for resigning should mean he was “that” guy, the guy that continued to play well.

“’And Odom needs to be told to stay in shape in the offseason?’

‘I doubt that was serious, but Lamar never had any issues being in shape before the season starts.’”

I’m sure it was serious. You really can’t have an important guy on your team not play or train all summer. Last season’s end, Odom clearly didn’t appreciate that. He’s also known as a big nightlife guy, living an unhealthy lifestyle.

I get the sense you don’t see any of the negatives about Odom or that you will just refuse to acknowledge those things in this discussion. And I don’t care about points at all. I care about overall impact on the team winning.

I’m not a hater, but I do see some flaws that are serious concerns to me that make him less valuable to me.

All potential free agents (and maybe others) do this. It is not an indication of anything…the same article was written about Hedo, etc. etc.

“I don’t really care that much about his mean performance. What concerns me is his impact on his team. Later in the season people are quoting impressive +/- stats for Odom. I’m concerned about the limited sample sizes for that. I don’t want him “stepping up.” I want him playing decently 3 out of every 4 games.”

-But he does produce similar or above average production from his constant, more so then the .75 ratio you have given. It’s just that people remember the few bad games then the many good ones.

“When Odom doesn’t show up, when you can’t count on him to defend well, or not get into foul trouble, or score at least 4 points, or not get another obvious offensive foul because he wants to go left EVERY time, etc., etc., I feel it puts an enormous strain on the team and the drop off can be catastrophic to the team’s overall performance.”

-For the few times his production drops from the mean, there are far more numerous times where his constant/above-average production puts his team in a higher level to succeed.

“My real, implied question which you didn’t really address is, “Given what we’ve seen in terms of how Odom can disappear for extended streaks of games and his obvious mental condition(s) underlying that disappearance, is he really a better priority for resigning than Ariza?””

-Yes. Scarcity/Production of his position at least to me gives him more value the Ariza, who is has a lot of value for himself already. Of course, that answer precludes to the circumstance of choosing one or the other.

“Maybe I’m just a sucker for strong defensive players with a lot of heart and effort that are younger. I don’t see wasted talent with Ariza. I do with Odom (which is his prerogative) and I hate being dependent on Odom having an okay game to win because I never know what to expect. I have no idea what Odom needs to step it up, but I worry that it may always require an adjustment (Bynum going down) or a novel situation (concern about showing Boston and Cleveland what’s up or fighting for a first title). I don’t want to count on a perfect storm for us to win.”

-Even though it’s not well known to most, Odom is an elite defensive player. Even though not proficient in steals (which plays a small part in the equation), he does well in PER/against, opp/eFG%, opp/TS% etc. In short, his opponents’ efficiency drops off against him.

“And I do still remember Odom playing Marion very well in the 2006 playoffs, but I also remember him blowing the rebound in game 6 that allowed Phoenix to send it into overtime.”

-I remember that last sequence, but I doubt Lamar “blew” it.

“Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t Odom a total no show in last year’s Finals?”

-No-show? So his production went down previous to the last 3 rounds, but so did the entire team.

“And Odom needs to be told to stay in shape in the offseason?”

-I doubt that was serious, but Lamar never had any issues being in shape before the season starts.

I agree with your post –Kobe should NOT take a pay cut. The guy is worth every cent plus 2X. I think you misread my post.

That’s pretty funny. “Star”bury, AI, Francis, Raef Lafrentz, ouch!

That’s a meaningless argument, because at this point you can’t do anything about those contracts.