The Lakers find themselves in an interesting dilemma. Just three years ago, they as long-term asset poor as a team could be. They had shipped out potential draft picks in an attempt to build a superstar team then saw those would be franchise anchors either break down or walk away for no return. Their future outlook was as dour as any other in the league outside of the Nets.
Fast forward to today and things are markedly different. In consecutive drafts the team has drafted the following list of players:
- 2014: Julius Randle, Jordan Clarkson
- 2015: D’Angelo Russell, Larry Nance, Jr., Anthony Brown
- 2016: Brandon Ingram, Ivica Zubac
It’s not yet known how good any of these players will end up being. But if the glimpses we have seen of them is any indication (even if only from summer league), a strong percentage of them (upwards of 6) look to at least be rotation players down the line. Some of them have star potential and three just completed their 1st training camp as part of the Team USA pipeline as members of the Select Team.
Review that list of players again. Now think of the positions they play. Russell and Clarkson are combo guards who can play either the point or shooting guard. Ingram is a SF, who may have some PF versatility when he adds some weight and strength. Randle and Nance are PF’s who, potentially, could moonlight as C’s in small-ball lineups for short stretches. Zubac is a pure C. Brown is a SG/SF. Since not all of these players have the same potential, let’s remove Zubac and Brown for a moment.
The Lakers have nearly every position covered, save for a full-time C, in their development pipeline. Players reaching their potential is never assured and should not be assumed, but I would imagine the team would like to give these players ample opportunities to show they can, in fact, fulfill their potential and approach their respective ceilings.
With that, one has to wonder, how picky can the Lakers’ be when seeking to build the next iteration of what they hope will be a roster which can make a deep playoff run. After all, no team ever should be in the business of turning away talent. If an elite player is available, trying to acquire him should be a consideration. However, if the Lakers are heavily invested in young, developing players at nearly every position, how do they go about looking to add to the roster in ways which improve the team while not inhibiting the growth of the players they are clearly high on?
I don’t have any answers here, but it is something worth keeping an eye on. Be it in free agency or via trade, players who are, roughly, top-25 talents become available nearly every season. This is the nature of the NBA, especially with the latest iteration of the CBA creating shorter contracts and the top players taking greater control of their career paths via opt-out clauses which put them into the free agency pool when they decide to be.
In bringing it back to the Lakers, they have multiple young players locked into team friendly contracts while also holding rights over their movement via restricted free agency for the next few years. Getting the most out of them should be of the highest priority, but must also be balanced with adding players who have the potential to be better than any of them.
Will the Lakers be patient? How picky can they actually be? Will they avoid targeting players at spots where it looks like they have enough talented players? Will they look to trade a player at a certain position in order to grab a more established veteran who is, at least in the short term, a real upgrade?
Again, I don’t have the answers here. And they may yet be influenced by a desire to win sooner than later or by the “timeline” Jim Buss is operating under. But how they navigate this path of building a winner will be one of the more interesting subplots to the coming seasons.
PatJardine says
Lakers have to be patient,it will be very interesting to see them develop,they could be good enough to win it all in a few years,who knows
A Horse With No Name says
The Jim Buss timeline is a chimera; dissipating with the almost certain doubling of wins, and possibly hitting the 40 wins mark. That would satisfy the fans and sponsors. Jeanie wouldn’t have the needed support of her vulture siblings to bring down the blade. Jim is likely safe, and knows it.
bball4ever says
“The Lakers have nearly every position covered, save for a full-time C, in their development pipeline”…ummmm Zubac ABSOLUTELY has above average starter potential. Is he going to be a quality starting center this year or next, no, but in 3-4 years when he gets in better shape, adds strength and quickness, refines his post moves moves (which already look good for a 19 year old) and continues to improve an already impressive 15-18 footer, he SHOULD be a quality starter. You are obviously massively underrating him by your quote.
KevTheBold says
Should we be concerned that they have not signed Ingram yet?
Do they have him in the window?
These Boogie rumors are like dripping acid on the noggin.
A Horse With No Name says
bball4ever
Not sure yet how high Zubac’s ceiling is, but I’m happily confident this kid has the goods to be a starter level player at his position. He really showed everything in summer league. As for covering the pick and roll, I think he has enough athleticism and feel for the game to become competent at it. That’s the only real question.
bball4ever says
A Horse With No Name bball4ever I agree, but every starting center cannot always guard the pick and roll, especially with against a top level point guard. Additionally, Zubac has shown incredible timing while protecting the rim without picking up lots of fouls as most big guys do in summer league, so even if he isn’t a good pick and roll defender if he is a good rim protector you take that, just don’t switch the pnr and have Zubac drop back most of the time
A Horse With No Name says
bball4ever A Horse With No Name
Excellent points. I thought to make the point about staying back as a rim protector (in fact, that’s what Marc Gasol does), but was too lazy and busy. (Sure. Right?)
new rr says
Bottom line on the timeline (no need for scare quotes):
1.Jim made the statement setting the timetable
himself; it was a clear statement, except to a degree for the 3-4 years part, and
he didn’t say anything about winning 35-40 games getting him off the hook. That
statement was made public in April of 2014. He later strongly implied that he
wanted until the end of 2018, which would be, as I have said, OK with me
personally. But, I am also not clear on why any Lakers fans would be especially
bummed out if someone else with better quals than Jim seemingly has oversaw
basketball ops unless they believe that Jim is the driving force/guiding hand behind
the last three drafts.
2.Jeanie has said more than once that she will
hold him to it.
3.No one except perhaps a few people at the top of
the Lakers hierarchy (and maybe not even them) seems to know whether it will be
enforced/adhered to, either by Jeanie forcing him out or by Jim stepping down, and
I have yet to see definitive, fact-based arguments that make it clear, to me,
at least, that either she can or cannot get rid of him if to comes down to an
actual palace fight. Even Horse, who is confrontational on this topic and assertive
in general, ultimately says that Jim is “likely” safe.
If the Lakers do make a big trade for a guy like Cousins or
Westbrook, I think that will pretty much settle the issue of whether the FO
takes the timeline seriously. But I don’t think that will happen.
LT Mitchell says
Jimbo mentioned Western Conference Finals and competing for championships by next year. If the team doesn’t even make the playoffs, he would have to be a weasel of epic proportions to go back on his word.
KevTheBold says
LT Mitchell
All this ‘timeline’ pressure is silly when you take serious consideration that the most intelligent timeline with regards to a team that’s capable of delivering championships, is the one that takes the proper time to develop our core.
All this “Jim said” nonsense was once a valid conversation, but now it’s urgings towards self destruction, impatience and shortsightedness.
It seems to me that some would relish a rash and stupid move from Jim, just to justify their obsessions, even if we all fall off the cliff down to that rocky bottom.
Well, I for one would like us to continue up this path we now have carved for ourselves, all the way to the top.
BigCitySid10552 says
– I believe the Lakers are in a pretty good spot. Obviously it would be better if they owned their 2017 1st round draft pick, but they don’t. This upcoming season, with a new 1st time head coach and so many young players, will be viewed & treated basically like a Honeymoon. After the last three seasons, the only way to go is up.
– Personally I’d like to get an idea of what this personnel is capable of doing when the game plan is about winning, not keeping a draft choice. I really don’t expect all these young guys to be on the team when the 2017-2018 season starts. 1 or 2 may be involved in a package for an all star vet like Cousins or Westbrook. That will happen, sooner or later, it’s what the Lakers do.
– But this season, 2016-17, I want to see if the Lakers have a budding star or dare I say better in their midst. This season, time is on the Lakers side. I don’t care about Jim Bus(t)’s timeline. Just hopes he let’s his basketball people do their jobs.
– Remaining free agents are starting to get to the point of taking low 1 year deals. If the Lakers are considering another center, 26 yr old 7 footer Tyler Zeller is still available. Also high risk/high reward Larry Sanders, 6’11 and only 27. Hey, Heat took a chance on Whiteside previously. A 1 year non-guaranteed contract may be something to consider (he’s currently receives $1.86 million per year until 2022 through his buyout with the Bucks).
KevTheBold says
Off topic, but it seems USA practice has paid off dividends on D’Angelo’s defense.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPlij2G-N1A
FredP says
Hey Darius, you raise a number of questions that beg to be answered. The messages from the FO remain mixed. After putting a very putrid product on the floor last season, they followed up with landing the most sought after head coach candidate and possibly the best player in the draft. This highlighted the terrific job the Lakers have done with their last 3 drafts. As you point out, the draft picks are all complementary. It is easy to imagine all of them being productive Lakers in the future. However, they played games with the salaries so that they can possibly land a big name player. On the one hand the theme is maximize player development and on the other it is win now. They cannot have it both ways.
As far as roster construction, Russell is the PG going forward. Pete Zayas has a detailed look at Russell’s time in summer league this year: <a href=”https://lakersoutsiders.com/2016/07/23/laker-film-room-episode-five-dangelo-russells-performance-in-summer-league/”>Russell</a>. The center needs to have the mobility and reach to challenge wings and the beef to play under the basket. Kind of like Zubac if he fills out. A wing is needed who has the height and wingspan to guard SG/SF’s like Brown for instance. The FO needs to have the patience and more importantly confidence in themselves to help make this work.
KevTheBold says
BigCitySid10552
Besides A. Brown, don’t see anyone who could not become an essential part of this team.
We were very fortunate to find and suffered for years to land these players, thus they are precious to us. Not something to trade away like bubble gum playing cards, just to a few more strokes on the win column.
Until such time that the Warriors, and Cleveland kill each other off, we aren’t going anywhere regardless, so we should use the time wisely.
bluehill says
KevTheBold How much fun did these guys going at each other?!?! Can only help their development.
Clay Bertrand says
BigCitySid10552
I agree with your first 3 points. Let’s see what we have and see who develops into what.
A couple of things to clear up:
1.) We still have our 2017 pick until we officially fall out of the Top 3. Who knows?? Maybe we project to get the 9th pick and we end up jumping to the 3rd??? Just sayin…..
2.) Tyler Zeller is returning to Boston
3.) Larry Sanders is returning to his Bong
Anyonemouse says
What the heck? Who said Jheri curls are back in vogue? Why is no one else talking about this?!!!
J C hoops says
Zubac is for real.
Lakers have done a great job with the draft. This year, however, is the year Randle and Russell mus show quantum leaps to justify considering them as long term franchise cornerpieces. By the end of this coming season, we’ll truly be able to judge their value.
It appears the FO already see Clarkson as having really value.Ingram is still a year out.
Clay Bertrand says
new rr
Perfect assessment of the hazy situation known as THE TIMELINE and the uncertainty around it.
I am one of those who separates Mitch from Jim Buss. But bringing in new blood or promoting new blood to the higher leadership position is going to happen eventually. After this season if Jim steps aside though, honestly what is lost that needs replacing??
Maybe Mitch as the head of Basketball Operations with Ryan West elevated to GM and Jesse Buss kept as Assistant GM/Head of Scouting (as he is currently) should happen sooner than later. They have shown to have drafted well even into the second round and they have as much promise as the other young “up and comers” we have all heard about and mentioned when you think about it.
Jim was never long for the job anyway but Jesse has been good at his job by all accounts (his getting arrested for being drunk and screaming laying in the middle of the street in Lexington Kentucky a few years ago aside).
If the young West and Buss can help further push the Lakers rebuild toward a winner, I’d think that they deserve to stay on.
I think that timeline or no timeline, the FO understands their asset situation and that they will not gut the young talent for a big star especially if: 1.) The fans are embracing the rebuild; and 2.) The on court development and improvement is clearly trending upward.
Shaunis007 says
BigCitySid10552 Zeller signed a 2 yr 16M deal with Boston
Shaunis007 says
We should all forget the timeline and be happy we have had probably the best drafts of any team in the league these past 3 years
only maybe minnesota has a better crop of young players and we are setup to compete after the lebron/durant warriors all start fading
it will be a bit longer but this team will be fun to watch
Clay Bertrand says
Anyonemouse
I thought they were tiny braids. If not, maybe he can score an endorsement with “SOUL GLOW”…………….
matt24 says
There are 11 new coached this year, i came across a webpage that ranked them
11. Pacers, McMillan. 10. Suns, earl Watson. 9. Nets, Atkinson. 8. Grizzlies, fizdale. 7. Lakers, walton. 6. Rockets, d’antoni. 5. Knicks, hornacek. 4. Wizards, scott brooks. 3. Kings, joerger. 2. Magic, vogel. 1. Twolves, thibodeau
I think Luke being behind, d’antoni and hornacek on this list is crap. So i would move him to 5th. We are all hoping he’s a great coach.
matt24 says
Zubac looks good, but preseason will be the real test
matt24 says
Lakers could retain the top 3 pick again in 2017, the way i see it they might only be better than 2 teams 76ers and nets……but here is a list of other teams we might be better than, magic, hawks, wizards, heat, kings, mavericks, pelicans, nuggets, suns, and rockets
MT87 says
matt24 This year is going to be a little weird for the league I think. The last few years have seen a few teams tanking and several teams that were improving but were still outside of the playoffs. This year all of the teams that weren’t in the playoffs last year are improved and are going to be trying to win games and maybe catch an 8 seed. All of the teams that were in the playoffs are trying to stay in.
I think the Lakers are going to be much better than last year but I also agree they are only going to be better than the 76ers and the Nets and maybe the Nuggets. It would take both lots of development all over our roster as well as some really disappointing starts for other more established teams in order for the Lakers to rise higher next season.
I wouldn’t be at all surprised if we kept our pick again.
nupe4life1996 says
Jim buss will beg for more time because the team seems headed upward….and jeanie aint got the balls to just throw him out or hold firm to the mandate..it was typical bragging jim with no substance, arrogant enough to think he could actually accomplish this like he felt with free agency the last 3 years. He is trying to be his dad without any credibility
Vasheed says
bball4ever
I believe Zubac has a good shot at becoming the starter this year. He might only be 19 but, he is a 265 pound 7′-1″ kid whom our coaches were surprised by how good of shape he was in summer league. He doesn’t commit silly fouls that you expect young centers to make and he already definitely has a better offensive skill set than Mozgov or Black. I believe as the year goes on Zubac can make a strong case to be the starter.
Busboys4me says
Luke’s initial proclamation is that Wins will not be important. He’s trying to teach his system and gauge how the new kids play together. This just might allow us to keep our first-round pick. I am of the understanding if we do keep that pick, we will be done with their obligation to Philadelphia. That would be awesome
matt24 says
Our young core and who is helping them develop
he rookies
Ingram – deng, a player who doesn’t seem to force anything, does everything well. Playing through a nba season, being a team player.
Zubac – mozgov still young as far as experience goes only started 2 seasons, but also a foreigner, could teach zubac offensive tricks.
All these players where on the team with kobe last year, kobe taught competitiveness and grit
Russell – Calderón has a good shot, but russell is likely already ahead of this guy. Last year nick young, off court drama.
Nance – last year brandon bass, team ball, position on the floor.
Clarkson – lou williams, how to find your way through defenses, how to shot in traffic, how to get to the foul line.
Randle and black – last year brandon bass and hibbert, defensive positioning, rolling to the basket, and rebounding
Busboys4me says
I see Brooklyn being horrendous next season. They might win 20. Miami will fall down to 25 wins. Philly will improve by 10 to 15 games and will win 25. Losing Gordon and Anderson will cost NO 10-15 games bringing them to 25 wins. We should win 25-30 games with everything we’ve done. Fourth and some more luck, we get to keep our pick. Top three protected.
matt24 says
I forgot to mention mwp last year, teaching randle and nance how to play a physical and scrappy game, also kobe instilling the firey emotions in clarkson and russell
matt24 says
Yeah alot of unknowns here, new coach should be better, but might struggle. A new center might match up well with centers in the west, its the way randle and mozgov play together that would make or break it. Tarik black playing an increased role right away. A new small forward will deng stay healthy and can he mesh with the youngsters, will he help defensively, how will ingram do as a rookie. What will the roles of caulderon and lou williams be.
??????? Alot of questions usually equals alot of loses
KevTheBold says
matt24
Good post!
Agree with all with the exception of Lou’s free throw theivery. It doesn’t fit with Clarkson’s clean persona, or indeed Walton’s.
I would like also to add that D’Angelo learned from lou, how NOT to handle personal conflict between two other team mates, and that lou is not be trusted.
Omega4life says
Nice post my brother. I agree with you on Jim. I do recognize that the lack of talent has hurt building a playoff contender, thanks to Stern (the nixed CPT3 trade). Had that happened, Jim might be viewed differently.
Not all of the decisions that failed were directly his fault. But, it is His problem to solve. I love the youth group and they have done an amazing job of selecting excellent players, through the draft.
Things are at least going in the right direction.
Still R says
Busboys4me Speaking of the Heat, they just basically stole Dion Waiters for 2.9 million buck$ !!
Omega4life says
I would take a look at Sanders. Excellent post
_Craig W says
Busboys4me We will lose our 2nd round pick to the 76ers next year and the following year – if we keep our 1st round pick. We will then lose our 1st round pick in 2018 (both 1st & 2nd would be lost). Then we will be done with all our obligations.
Darius Soriano says
Busboys4me If the Lakers keep their top-3 protected 1st round pick next year, the 1st round pick they owe the 76ers becomes unprotected and will go to the Philly in 2018 regardless of where it lands. Additionally, if they keep their pick in 2017, the 1st round pick they owe the Magic as part of the Howard trade turns into two 2nd-round picks.
_Craig W says
Darius Soriano Busboys4me Sorry I got it wrong. Thanks Darius
Runningstrong615 says
I think the front office has already done a decent job of trying to surround our young core with some veteran leadership. Deng is a consummate professional and will go a long ways in mentoring Ingram, Nance, and Randle. I don’t think it gets appreciated or considered enough but Mozgov is now a champion. He practiced and trained everyday with an MVP and witnessed first hand what it takes to get to the top. I’m a fan of bringing in guys, even if they weren’t the man, who have won before and competed at the highest level. It’s the same as bringing in Harper or Horry or reuniting with D Fish. You can’t coach the experience those guys had. People forget what a beast Mozgov was in the 2015 playoffs, particularly on the boards and the defensive end, and the only reason he didn’t get off the bench in 2016 was because Kevin Love was healthy, unlike the 2015 playoffs. I’m not sure why you wanted to gloss over Zubac but I’m pleased with what I saw in Summer league. The kid has soft hands, something we all wish Kwame Brown had, and his best quality, he really wants to be here and get better, something we all wish Dwight Howard and Bynum had. I’m really glad they brought back Huertas for his style of play and basketball IQ. With all that, they do need to still unload Nick Young. The Lakers don’t need to surround our core with knuckleheads and drama. For Russel’s sake, it’s best to move past that chapter.
Last thing, more props to whoever it is in the front office who is selecting our last 3 years of draft picks. Prior to that you can go thru our draft selections and see a bunch of whiffs. Our scouting department has done a great job recently even though these guys are still young and the final verdict is still out. It’s my understanding that this might be one of the other Buss kids (Jim & Jeanie’s half brother) who is in charge of scouting. If that is the case then I wouldn’t mind seeing an expanded roll for him along with getting rid of this whole self imposed Jim Buss timeline. The Jim Buss timeline is just a distraction and could ultimately be detrimental to the team if we tried to fast track the rebuild by trading our young core. Laker fans just want to see improvement to the point where one day we are competing for Championships again. One superstar, probably not even 2 superstars will bring that championship. If the young core becomes legit in 2-3 years (Russel and Ingram become superstars and the other guys grow and become key contributors) then all we’ll need is one star to join in free agency and the pitch to that caliber of free agent becomes much more compelling.
AnonLakerFan says
new rr I do not believe the FO is under any fear that this is the last year they have to to put together a contender. Here’s why:
Assuming your typical LLC structure for the Laker organization where Jeannie sits as President, then I think she has the power to fire/hire anyone on the Laker staff – including any of her brothers. This is likely the case as she has said in the past that any final decision rests solely with her. So, why has she not acted?
Well, that is likely because the LLC itself is controlled by the Buss Family Trust, which in turn is controlled by the three trustee siblings. In theory, if she were to fire Jim and not have the backing of Johnie, then Jim+Johnie could retaliate by removing her as President of the Lakers. This, of course, is a scenario no one wants as it would cause significant damage the Laker brand.
So Jeannie’s options for amicable resolution are limited to hoping that Jim honors his “timeline.” Problem for Jeannie is that she has several instances over the last 4-5 years where she speaks to the press and makes statements that are widely viewed as negative toward the FO. We can all take sides in terms of whether this is the right approach of not, but if you look at it from the point of view of Jim Buss, he would likely argue to Jeannie and Johnie (and his siblings) that Jeannie’s actions significantly undermine his plans. I think Jim would also likely argue that because of this, he needs more time – and less meddling by Jeannie – to truly be given a fair shot at trying to fulfill his promise.
I think this is the most likely explanation of where we are now and why Jeannie, in light of the negativity of the Kevin Ding article, recently took to the airwaves to deliver a message of unity via Ramona Shelbourne. Compare those comments to the interview she gave in 2015 and you will see a 180 degree change in her tone.
So, this is my long-winded way of saying that I do not believe the FO is under any fear that this is the last year they have to to put together a contender. My gut tells me that Jim will be given this offseason *and* next to prove himself to his critics within the Buss family. If by the All Star break in Feb 2018 this team is not headed toward the playoffs, then I think Jimbo will step down.
Still R says
Good thing Calderon came over with a couple 2nd round picks.
Still R says
Semirelared: teams can only pay up to $3.4 million yearly on trade considerations, which caps the value of 2nd round picks – not to mention first round picks !! – very low.
BigCitySid10552 says
For those who believe the Lakers will keep their top 3 protected draft pick, unless they just get a lucky draw in the lottery, forget. No way these guys will have one of the 3 worst w-l records.
Clay Bertrand says
AnonLakerFan new rr
Pretty astute reading of the tea leaves. Clearly the Lakers have no reason to publicly reveal the intricacies of the voting rights of the controlling entity whether it be the Trust directly or via a traditional business entity. So we will never really know with any certainty what the situation is behind the scenes.
However, I do think its safe to say that ALL Buss family members want AND NEED the Lakers to be successful. I really don’t sense an underlying power struggle per se or spitefulness. I don’t see ANY the Busses as overly ambitious in terms of trying to usurp, consolidate, or even wield Power over other family members or the organization as a whole. Not getting along is one thing. Backstabbing and powergrabbing is quite another. Luckily they seem to be mature enough to recognize this. They also seem to really enjoy their lives NOT being part of the Lakers day to day operations it seems. Even Jim and Jeanie are not fighting for control of the franchise or anything like that.
At the end of the day, I think that the Buss family members would for the most part be very content if the team is doing well and their checks keep flowing in. I don’t mean to say they don’t care about the team or that they are ONLY money hungry at all. I just think that the leadership crisis we have seen over the last few years could be salved incredibly by on court improvement and the greater fan base embracing and buying into this young group.
IOW, Winning Cures All…….to a degree at least.
Clay Bertrand says
BigCitySid10552
I’d rather be Lucky than Good!!!! Orrrrr more accurately, I’d rather be lucky than BAD ENOUGH TO EARN A TOP PICK!!!! We’ve had enough of that!!!!
But the Karma pendulum from the VETOED CP3 Deal might still have some momentum to give us………It might still be swinging our way next Lottery draw……
I don’t believe we will get a Top 3 pick…..But I do believe its POSSIBLE however unlikely.
new rr says
Clay Bertrand AnonLakerFan new rr
AnonLakerFan: I respect the effort that you put into that post, and you may be 100% right. The 2018 All-Star break would be a reasonable time for Jim to step down if things are not clearly looking up.
But, again, WADR, you are saying stuff like I believe, my gut tells me, etc. So, AFAICT, we don’t know for sure whether Jeanie can pull the trigger.
MT87 says
BigCitySid10552 That’s what I thought until I started going through rosters one by one. If one of the Laker’s players takes the leap and becomes a proven star this year (D’angelo) we are probably better than bottom three. Otherwise the competition is really going to be that tough. Are we going to be better than the Pelicans with Anthony Davis or the Kings with Boogie? Those are my barometers personally.
fern16 says
We aint keeping that damn pick. Is people that glutton for punishment? I think we used up all the luck we could expect to have the last 3 years.I expect an upward trajectory this time around. 25-30 wins, we shouldn’t be lowering the expectations. Best case scenario? Striking distance from the 8th seed. And no shot to keep that stupid pick. I think the Lakers have done an outstanding job in the Draft but it’s time to move on. Right now all that talk about other rosters and all that is just that, talk. Some teams will underperform some teams will defy expectations.
fern16 says
Yeah Dion Waiters, great shooting guard who shoots less than 40 fg%. Yeah what a steal. I actually was worried that the Lakers would grab him…
Still R says
fern16 Don’t worry, the second year of his deal is a player option, so they may still get lucky.
matt24 says
I’m not hoping to keep the pick, I’m saying the roster is not that impressive. I hope your right and I’m wrong I hate watching them lose.
mattal says
For what it’s worth — ESPN Summer NBA projections have the Lakers finishing 15th in the West with a 25-57 record.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/17131591/2016-summer-forecast-west-standings
MT87 says
fern16 Its not like I want to keep the pick. The Western Conference is basically one contender and a huge middle class without any teams obviously or covertly tanking. We aren’t the only team who was a bottom feeder last year sporting an improved roster, developing young players, and the beginnings of serious expectations.
The Timberwolves are basically in the same place that we are, except they have KAT who is already a stud. That team is more likely to be in the playoffs next year than we are and I think their prospects are overrated.
The Suns have a glut of young talent including a pg in Bledsoe who is already a better two-way player than anyone we have and Booker who is going to be Klay Thompson with better passing and handle before too long.
The Nuggets are going to be better. The Kings and the Pelicans still have first-rate superstars. The Jazz have been a playoff-level team that hasn’t been able to squeeze in for a couple of years now. All of these teams are hoping to unseat one of the teams that was in the playoffs last year and all of those teams are planning to stay in the playoffs.
We are going to be better than last year. We are going to be much more fun and watchable and exciting. We aren’t going to be a playoff team unless Dlo and Clarkson discover they really can play defense and Julius (or Nance) discovers a league average 3pt shot.
Don’t be surprised when we turn in a bottom five record next year but still improve massively. It isn’t a knock on our talent, just a marker of where we are in the process. It isn’t like there is an award for being the first team in line to be destroyed by the Warriors.
LordMo says
The pick is a lock! Nbadraft.net has us picking 2nd again this time we get Giles! We will have a monster team once these guys mature. But that is about 3 to 4 years away unless U get an instant star. These guys will improve but will take a step back initially without Kobe but need the growing pains.
We are going to take some lumps but man when they finally click it could be awesome and some title runs to boot. Don’t want any FA’s anymore… Forget them! They shunned and ignored us…. Patience! Payback is coming!
LordMo says
The most realistic post here!
Our improvement will not be measured by increased wins. The kids still don’t know how to be pros let alone win in this league. Off the court actions just as important and they will not have Kobe to steer them. A leader has to emerge so who is it now?
See…. Long long way to go…. Might lose 20 games in a row before you figure that out.
Twovles – better than us any day of the week right now. Kris Dunn might eat DAR alive… That kid is tough! U said Towns is a stud then Wiggins is a superstud bro he is already an all star caliber player and who knows how good he is going to get… They are young and good. We are just young… big difference!
Suns – better and prolly won’t try to tank anymore which means they going to roast us for real now.
Kings – Better than us but possibly more dysfunctional than us. Boogie owns us tho when interested.
Utah – Better and young like we are but they are poised to take the next step after a promising year.
Nuggets – see Kings ditto. But they find good euro talent and if EM gets a jumper watchout.
fern16 says
It’s a young team that will take a few lumps and bruises but fewer than last year. With Kobe and specially Byron gone and a new coach that will put a system in place that benefit these kids and play to their strengths the team should be better.
fern16 says
Pick is a lock… Right…
LordMo says
Wrong bro could be the worst team in the league. Defense is going to be a big issue both guards and ur PF can’t guard anyone and ur new wing weighs 180.
fern16 says
That’s bull, wins matter. You can’t show 16 wins at the end of the season and call that “improvement You measure sucess by winning games, not moral victories. “Ohh we has lost 8 in a row but the team has shown improvement” that won’t cut it.
fern16 says
Like i said some of those teams will play better than expected others will underperform. The Lakers could fall easily on any of those categories. At this point all these bottom teams is all in paper. You know what to expect with the higher teams mostly but these young teams? Nobody knows how they will perform until the season starts.
matt24 says
Nbadraftnet probably just carrying over the draft order, likely means nothing. Vegas odds are usually correct.
LordMo says
Nope sorry all those teams are better than us!
LordMo says
Randle yes it is his 3rd year. Russell has more time playing a harder position to learn. And who says Randle is a franchise player only hear that on this board?
Kobe was asked and his answer was “no one on this roster….no one!”
MT87 says
fern16 No doubt. I don’t disagree with either of your last two posts right here. If the Lakers win 16 games the season is a failure in my opinion. However, that isn’t what I think is going to happen.
Let me try to be more clear about my prediction for next year. I think two teams who were in the playoffs in the West last year (most likely Mavs and Rockets) will probably be out next year because of injury or regression or whatever. The Lakers could take one of those spots but there are going to be four or five other teams justifiably thinking the same thing.
I think the whole league is going to see fewer really high win teams and fewer high loss teams next year. The last few years we have seen four or five really good contenders and at least a few teams trying to lose lots of games each season. This year there are two, and only two, contenders. Meanwhile all the tank projects that were ongoing have been ceased. I think the net effect will be a league with much more parity outside of the top two. That was what I was thinking of by the middle class anyway. Considering how much power is concentrated at the top next year maybe huddled masses is more appropriate, but I digress.
The last few years we have seen a few teams lose games at record-breaking paces. That probably won’t happen this year. The Lakers might both win 30 games and get the second pick. I’d rather be in the playoffs every day of the week but which is more likely from where we sit today?
MT87 says
LordMo Defense is very much going to be the issue. I’m hoping that with a better coach and a modern offensive system the young guys will show more dedication to the defensive end. They will go as far as their defense takes them and no farther.
MT87 says
fern16 As I think about this, 30 wins and the second pick isn’t that likely but still, would it be crazier than storming to the 8th seed?
Joe Kerr says
I have the Lakers winning 25 wins next season. That should be around the 5th worst record in the NBA. Lets hope the Lakers keep their pick next season too.
Vasheed says
fern16
I don’t think the Lakers are likely to keep their pick either. With the 2nd worst record in the league last year the Lakers only had a coin’s flip chance of keeping it and fortunately lucked out. Assuming the Lakers get the 3rd worst record the odds would shift that most likely they lose their pick. I don’ t think it would take much luck for the Lakers to leap frog a few teams from 3rd worst record to like 5th worst record and by that point the odds of keeping the pick become abysmal. I’m hopeful our team can do better than that though.
bleedpurplegold says
I think a lot of this depends on how the season starts for us. If we get a couple of bottom feeders to start and win 4 of the first 6, that will give our young crew confidence for the first half of the season and we will be hanging around .500 around all star break, getiing a few wins every here and there. If they lose 4 or 5 of the first six, i expect us to finish dead last in the west and maybe with the 2nd or thrd worst in the league
Bottom line is you cant say how a talented young group will play, it all depends on their focus and behaviour during the season. Losing doesnt help a young guy, usually you try to compensate that misery with things like partying or shopping to feel good again….which wont help the on-court product
matt24 says
Lets forget about how many wins were projected, I’m excited that the team is built around the development of the youngsters, loul deng should be able to play well through his contract he won’t take the bulk of minutes with ingram, and nance as prospects in the same spot, at this point in his career kobe played a smarter game, but still destroyed himself trying to carry the team, deng is not kobe but look at the positive he is perfect for this situation an above adverage player who needs to decrease in minutes in order to maximize his efficiency. Randle should be more fun to watch as he excels and this type of coach should help his game, instead of forcing shots he will be taught to let it come to him, I think nance jr is the perfect draymond green canadite on the team expect nance is not as nasty in attitude he will be encouraged to take shots. Russell is a growning pains developmental player, he likely will excell tremendously on offense, (he ran the O and shot well in SL)but it’s the defense were he will struggle this year. Clarkson should outperform his contract and emerge as a top shooting guard, he seems very teachable, but has played on the iso offense, and I hope he’s able to adjust. The center position got me scratching my head, mozgov has the size for the west, and matches up well with most of the west starters, but has never adveraged over 25 minutes, can tarik black be a servicable backup, (I’m hoping for a trade for a expiring big) zubac is in a good spot to develop, but we don’t wanna ruin his confidence, he could get humiliated at his age. I really hope ingram is a laker his entire career, i believe he’s gonna require patience and won’t look promising till about his 3rd season…
matt24 says
Yeah to add, the rules are you can’t lose a first round pick 2 years in a row, so it just gets pushed back to next year, so Brooklyn will get to keep their pick this season ( 2017)
matt24 says
Yeah, I just realized byron scott is gone we are not keeping the pick, he’s the ultimate tank commander, high draft pick getter.
J C hoops says
Shopping! Funny. Not sure how that affects on court performance but maybe. Shopping is exhausting
J C hoops says
I agree Fern. But like, calm down buddy
MT87 says
LordMo If Randle really does develop a reliable 3pt shot his value goes up by an order of magnitude at least. I don’t know if that makes him a franchise player exactly but he could be an all-star level cornerstone.
If he doesn’t develop a reliable jump shot than he might not be better than a sixth man. None of our players is a franchise player as it stands today. We’ve still got more potential than anything else.
MT87 says
bleedpurplegold I’d be pretty surprised personally if this team played close to .500 this year.